Tuesday, June 20, 2006

Murtha vs. Rove

Murtha vs. Rove: Stepping up the recent disagreement on the Iraq war, Pennsylvania Rep. John Murtha ridiculed Karl Rove on Meet the Press Sunday.

Rove criticized Murtha's call for a quick withdrawal. He rebuked the Democrats' "old pattern of cutting and running."

In response, Murtha said, "You can't sit there in the air-conditioned office and tell troops carrying 70 pounds on their backs, inside these armored vessels hit with IED's every day, seeing their friends blown up-their buddies blown up -- and he says stay the course? Easy to say that from Washington, D.C."

How did America come to trust those who have never been to war to run one?

Murtha is a patriotic American who obviously loves his country and understands the horrors that the troops are facing in Iraq. Horrors that many on the so-called left oppose. Iraq is in tatters, nothing has worked the way it was envisioned by the Bush group, we now have more enemies than ever in my lifetime, and this country feels less safe than it ever has in my lifetime.

The home needs of our country have been left to flounder while we turned our eye to the oilfields of the middle-east: schools, our community infrastructures, health care, social security, to name a few.

The Bush obsession with Iran and Iraq reminds me of the eye of Mordor focused on finding the Ring of Power while the lands allied to Mordor wither and grow bleak. There is a darkness, a desperation, a hunger to his seeking control in the middle-east, beyond any desire to create democracy there, and there is an old-fashioned value called honor that has been lost in the process.

Murtha is a true patriot who has put his money where his mouth is. He has fought to defend and uphold the liberty of this country and the principles upon which it was founded. Rove, on the other hand, is focused on increasing his own power and the power base of the Republican Party at the expense of the soldiers who are bravely willing to put their lives on the line for us.


At 6:00 AM, Blogger PTCruiser said...

You hit the nail right on the head, Glenda. Who better to give their opinion on war than a warrior himself, a man who both served with and led men into battle? John Murtha is a true patriot. Excellent post.

At 6:11 AM, Blogger Sue Woo said...

Hi Glenda!

I still wonder how the draft dodgers won over the ones who actually Went to War. I think they need to be gone, before somebody drops a house on them.

At 6:30 AM, Blogger glenda said...

Thanks, PT, we are in this together!

Actually, sue, not sure if I am reading your comment correctly, but I do believe in the freedom to conscientiously object to war, if that is a religious belief, such as for Quakers and Amish (and others) as I support the Constitution and the Bill of Rights and freedom of religion. My grandfather, father, uncles and brother all served in the military.

I also believe in fighting to defend this country when we are attacked, such as after Pearl Harbor or 9/11, but do not think this war was justified, since Osama and Al Quaeda are not part of the Iraqi government. We should have finished the job in Afghanistan, captured Osama and worked to stop terrorism from spreading instead of pouring gasoline on the flames of terrorism.

At 9:30 AM, Blogger celticfire said...

Yes, very intetesting post. Murtha seems like a good guy :)

At 10:58 AM, Blogger JM said...

Thank goodness that Murtha is out there as an effective voice of reason. There are so very few that can combine high creditability and a high profile like him.

At 11:06 AM, Blogger Time said...

If we are serious about the war on terror, that is a world wide fight. Why didn't we stop the terrorist from taking Sammila? The terrorist bombed Spain, England, and other countries.

We need to stop pussy-footing with Saudi Ariba where the Islamic terrorist are, we need to get to Asia where the Islamic terrorist are, and on and on.

We need to take lessons from Isreal who have been living with and fighting terrorism for decades.

We need to tighten our countries security. Trains, airports, ports, bus stations, boarders, everything.

When President Bush said he was going to eliminate Evil from the world, he commited us to a world wide fight.

That's why I disagree with this President, he doesn't even know what he has gotten us into.

At 11:23 AM, Anonymous earl bockenfeld said...

"There will be no early withdrawal as long as we run the Congress and occupy the White House." - Bush's extraordinarily blustery red-faced speech last night.

The thing that just about everybody else don't seem to understand is Bush equates leaving with losing. There will be no significant withdrawal from Iraq, if any, as long as Bush is in office. Bush is ensuring that we have the status quo until January 2009 at the earliest, almost 6 years after the start of the war.

I believe we'll call that length of time "one Bush" even if some people prefer "one Arbusto."

Even in Vietnam, for all the mistakes the US made there, Richard Nixon kept escalating the conflict. But it is at least different from letting a flawed policy grind through money and men for three years because you don't have the moral courage to rethink it or adjust course. It's denial elevated to the level of high principle.

Is it now conventional wisdom among the punditry that leaving = losing? Can you say "Oil" and "Permanent bases in Iraq are the Bu$h goal."?

I'm no Frank Luntz, but maybe it'd be worth countering the leaving = losing meme with a more logical staying = losing.

If we stay, we lose. Even more of our soldiers will lose their lives and their limbs, and their health. Families will keep losing their sons and daughters. The country will keep losing hundreds of billions of dollars that it doesn't have. We'll keep losing what's left of our international allies and moral authority. We'll lose even more credibility as our invasion of Iraq becomes an occupation, despite our promises to the contrary. We'll keep losing our ability to defend the country from countries that DO have WMDs.

We have nothing to gain from staying. Saddam is gone and there are no WMDs in Iraq. All we're doing now is catching bullets as Shi'ites and Sunnis kill each other. The story of Iraq may one day have a happy ending, but it doesn't have anything to do with us anymore. Staying is the only way to guarantee we keep losing.

At 11:36 AM, Blogger glenda said...

jm, yes, there are few that can hold what I call gravitas with both conservatives and liberals. What we needs are visionaries with concrete plans who are willing to take a moral stance!

Time, agreed, he has no long-range vision, and is surrounded by pundits who are loyal at the cost of keeping their opinions to themselves. Thsu, he has no sounding board. He meely hears the echo of his and his handlers words coming back over and over.

Earl, I think the Repubs have used the phrase "cut and run" so many times that they are perhaps not objective about what they are doing, and are more afraid of THE PERCEPTION that they are "cutting and running" that they are to stay for the wrong reaon. It's all such a weird set of prioroties and there is not going to be a win in this mess, just a mess and more death if we stay and a massacre when we leave. They are afraid of leaving and afraid of a massacre more than an "acceptable loss of American lives."
And ,as you point out, we are spending on our kids nd grandkids credit cards like there is no tomorrow. I can't tell you how strange it is to find myself being more of a fiscal conservative than the Republicans!

At 1:25 PM, Blogger Sue Woo said...

Oops sorry. I mean that Bush, Rove, Chaney, et al wiggled out of service to our country. The guys who served, Murtha, et al, are getting trashed by them. How is that/ That's what I meant. I have spent my adult life in opposition of war, but I support those who have served and are serving now. My nephew returned from Iraq in March. Let's drop a house on Karl Rove! let's pick a big one!

At 2:17 PM, Blogger Gary said...

Murtha makes me proud to be a Pennsylvania citizen!

You should have heard him skewer Rove on the Countdown.

At 3:02 PM, Blogger glenda said...

Thanks for the clarification, sue woo, I thought that might be what you were thinking. And I agree. They've never been out there on the front lines....

gary, I envy those of you who can live in a state with a guy like murtha...I only got Tom DeLay and Kay Bailey Hutchison, and the long list of neocans who are from Texas!

At 4:40 PM, Blogger WeezieLou said...

bush has always been in denial of the major issues facing the American public. hey, he thought the FEMA director was doing a 'heck of a job'
with katrina! (another body was just found last week).

i see much of this shit intertwined with bush and alcohol. he's always been in denial that he had a real problem. 'denial' exists in the addict to distort reality and make was is NOT seem as if it IS and vice versa. what really scares me about the bush-els is how totally right they think they are, how supremely self-confident. seems to me that anyone with a brain has both internal checks and balances, and friends who help with same - someone to tell you when you're wrong. the smugness of this admin and its defenders makes me seethe.
i'm not going to pretend i know the answers to iraq and the war on terror. but knowing i don't know, and would seek help from others, seems a hell of a lot healthier than assuming i alone held The Truth.

At 5:10 PM, Blogger glenda said...

Who can argue with that, Weezielou? Hell, I've been with h\Bush in the Governor's office when he made no sense to me....!

At 5:18 PM, Blogger John Good said...

Excellent analogy there, Glenda. We need alot more Frodo's to defend us from the evil sorceror wanna-be Bush. . .

At 7:08 PM, Blogger Peacechick Mary said...

My daughter and I have sent several thank you/love notes to Murtha hoping that we can keep his spirits up while he takes on the evil ones. Great analogy!

At 5:02 AM, Blogger Sothis said...

Bush has a history of addition problems. When confronted with "you are screwing up your life! (in this case the entire world)" he reponds with, "I am in control" when in fact, any fool can see that is not the case. I've seen a lot of evangelicals just like him who bottomed out on drugs and alcohol, then find Jesus. Problem is, they trade a addiction to a substance, to an addiction to religion. Bush actually believes God told him to do this and has called it a "crusade." As he is being irrational, no amount of reason is going to turn him around (same thing with a junkie). He doesn't care about Congree, the American people, or our laws. And he justifies it to himself because he thinks he is chosen by God to lead.

Nothing is going to change until people actually register to vote, go to the polls, and boot his ass back to Texas. Unfortunately, I fear the damage he has done to basic rights of citizens may be long term if not permanent.

At 5:36 AM, Blogger glenda said...

I am with you on the thinking about long-term damage to our country. Just please don't boot him back to us!!

C'mon, can't he go to another state for a while, for example, a LOOONg visit to his brother Jeb in Florida???

And yes, assuming he is not using drugs or alcohol, he is what some would call a dry drunk, that is, he has the hallmarks of an addictive personality, thinking and behavior.

At 9:29 AM, Blogger Gary said...

Well, we are lucky with him.

Unfortunately, I am sure the Froth-of-Santorum more than counters any good Murtha does!

Fortunately, I think the good people of Pennsylvania are going to send Tricky-Rick to Virginia for good.

And good ridence!

At 3:58 PM, Blogger Andrew Baker said...

so refreshing and reassuring to hear the views that you have expressed - particularily for a Brit.
The important issue is that we have forgotten that we are chasing our shadow rather than looking into the light. If instability and the deaths of innocence are to be avoided, we have to build coalitions with other parties around the world and not break them as we have with the move into Iraq.
We are now seen in the way we have been portrayed by some voices in the middle east. As agents of vested interest out to take what does not belong to us rather than being honest brokers for peace and justice.
We will repent at length over our hasty mistakes. Lets hope democracy reaches us first before we can comfortably export it elsewhere.

At 11:11 AM, Blogger podvizhnik said...

I'm not qualified to say anything meaningful about John Murtha himself, though I'm not sure I can agree with calls for an immediate pullout from Iraq.

Whether we fix blame for the mess there on Bush, Rove, Saddam Hussein, or anyone else, the fact is that there is a hell of a mess there. While Iraqis are needlessly dying now, I have looked for, and so far failed to find, any convincing argument that bringing back our troops will ameliorate the situation for them. Shouldn't we do something to clean it up? Just 'declaring victory and going home,' Vietnam-style (which is how the politicians would manage it), doesn't meet the test for me.

Even the most jaundiced observer can't deny that Germany and Japan embraced democracy in the years after World War 2. And democracy wasn't any more native to their soil than it is to Iraq's; Germany had a legacy of a thousand years of Kaisertum, while Japan had an even longer one of warlords and empire. Yet they are democracies now, and solid ones. While the Germans wrote their own constitution, Japan's basic constitution is still that written for them by Douglas MacArthur, and they seem content to keep it even sixty years later. Those are facts. Why can't we start to manage something similar now?

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